[Bryan]

Got to make a quick pass on a Dynojet the other day....Only got to make one pass and it was on the stock knobbies, not sure if that hurts or helps but just an FYI.

Bike made 46whp/31wtq...#'s arent great and I know there are stock bikes making more power than that but its dyno to dyno...so I dont need to hear anything is wrong with it...it runs hard I assure you... For comparisons sake...my buddies 05 YFZ with...

KENZ ported head
ESR Intake
Ron Woods Drag pipe
Crower Cams
CDI Box
Ported carb

Made 48whp/30wtq with near perfect A/F....Im all for Dyno Queen bikes but this dyno doesnt allow for it

NOW to A/F .... its between 14.5-15.1 from 5500- redline. I guess I gotta bite my tounge thinking the A/F was ok cause the bike ran so good after the motor build. Power commander/FIMAK is gonna be on the way so I should have some sheets relatively soon after the tune :fro: This was on straight C12...there is no audible detonation so it being that lean actually kind of suprised me.

Anybody have any opinions on which is more user friendly...PC or FIMAK?

Thanks!!

 

[AL Elks]

Got to make a quick pass on a Dynojet the other day....Only got to make one pass and it was on the stock knobbies, not sure if that hurts or helps but just an FYI.

Bike made 46whp/31wtq...#'s arent great and I know there are stock bikes making more power than that but its dyno to dyno...so I dont need to hear anything is wrong with it...it runs hard I assure you... For comparisons sake...my buddies 05 YFZ with...

KENZ ported head
ESR Intake
Ron Woods Drag pipe
Crower Cams
CDI Box
Ported carb

Made 48whp/30wtq with near perfect A/F....Im all for Dyno Queen bikes but this dyno doesnt allow for it

NOW to A/F .... its between 14.5-15.1 from 5500- redline. I guess I gotta bite my tounge thinking the A/F was ok cause the bike ran so good after the motor build. Power commander/FIMAK is gonna be on the way so I should have some sheets relatively soon after the tune :fro: This was on straight C12...there is no audible detonation so it being that lean actually kind of suprised me.

Anybody have any opinions on which is more user friendly...PC or FIMAK?

Thanks!!
[/b]

I've heard the PC is more user friendly but If I remember correctly it takes a laptop to tune it. I really like the FIMAK I'm using. It's actually idiot proof (which is a plus for me). You're definately running lean in my opinion. I know I wouldn't run that high of AFR. The highest I might go is 14:1 just to see how she runs.

 

[Bryan]

I've heard the PC is more user friendly but If I remember correctly it takes a laptop to tune it. I really like the FIMAK I'm using. It's actually idiot proof (which is a plus for me). You're definately running lean in my opinion. I know I wouldn't run that high of AFR. The highest I might go is 14:1 just to see how she runs.
[/b]

Yeah...its definately way too lean...I didnt think it would be that high. I wanna be in the 13.0-13.5 range on A/F....

have you had your bike on a dyno w/ air/fuel at all?

 

[AL Elks]

Don't need a dyno.

I have a bung welded into my exhaust pipe with a bosch 5 wire oxygen sensor that hooks to an LM-1. It allows me to monitor my AFR at all RPMs and logs the results. I"m at about 13.2:1 to 13.3:1 right now. I'm going to stop at 13.5:1. When I'm done tuning I just take out the oxygensensor and put in a plug and away I go.

I have a full Yoshi, modified airbox withthe Trinity intake. Also have the PIM and FIMAK.

 

[Bryan]

Don't need a dyno.

I have a bung welded into my exhaust pipe with a bosch 5 wire oxygen sensor that hooks to an LM-1. It allows me to monitor my AFR at all RPMs and logs the results. I"m at about 13.2:1 to 13.3:1 right now. I'm going to stop at 13.5:1. When I'm done tuning I just take out the oxygensensor and put in a plug and away I go.

I have a full Yoshi, modified airbox withthe Trinity intake. Also have the PIM and FIMAK.
[/b]

ahhh Nice...can you monitor that under a load?

Im just trying to avoid being at the dyno all day...kinda why I want user friendly set up, Im with you on the idot proof part...I dont have the patience to be fixing my screw ups over and over. About how long did it take you to dial in a/f throughout the powerband?

 

[schl48]

bryan and al, the really good a/f optimized is 12.45-13.1. this is spot on. the closer you get to that the better the motor runs. you can get that with the pc for sure and most likely the pim and fimak. al you will love the pc. more options than fimak so far. not sure for how long. hp numbers don't mean a whole lot in my opinion numbers are great to get an idea on which way u r going. i chase numbers on the dyno bad habit.

 

[Bryan]

bryan and al, the really good a/f optimized is 12.45-13.1. this is spot on. the closer you get to that the better the motor runs. you can get that with the pc for sure and most likely the pim and fimak. al you will love the pc. more options than fimak so far. not sure for how long. hp numbers don't mean a whole lot in my opinion numbers are great to get an idea on which way u r going. i chase numbers on the dyno bad habit.
[/b]

Yeah...thats about what im goin for...I wanna nail it around 13.0 across the whole powerband. But im with you...couldnt really care less what the HP# is, just use it to make sure Im not taking steps backwards.

Im tuning it after work today at Dynojet...so I'll post up how easy/hard it was :fro:

 

[764]

That Innovate LM-1 is the stuff!

I'd be willing to bet it's giving you better readings that a sniffer in the tailpipe on the dyno... Good call Al. I wonder if Softone has an LM-1? :lol:

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lm1.php

schl48 are you from KR? did you buy an ltr?

Dave

 

[Bryan]

I'd be willing to bet it's giving you better readings that a sniffer in the tailpipe on the dyno... Good call Al. I wonder if Softone has an LM-1? :lol:



Dave
[/b]

Doubt it...The sniffer and a welded in bung are in pretty similar positions. If they differ, its not gonna be noticeable. Optimun reading for A/F are gonna be the first few inches of the header...unfortunately thats not possible with the 'sniffer' and probably not a great idea for the LM-1. Either way...whatever floats your boat.

All I can say is the power commander is bad ass... We plugged it in... set the a/f into the adjustment box for 13:1 and made a few pulls. The computer made every tiny adjustment itself for perfect a/f at 100% throttle...went to 80% throttle, same thing..perfect a/f all the way from bottom to top. 60% throttle...perfect a/f....all the way down to 5% throttle.

The a/f almost looks fake...straight 13:1 all the way across.

My old a/f was hitting 15:1 8-10k rpms....I actually picked up 2.5hp frpm 9k-10k rpms(peak remained the same), but I lost a few ft lbs peak from fattening it up

Its kind of decieving because the bike actually makes power earlier and holds on longer...even though I lost 2.5 ft lbs peak and gained nothing peak hp wise.

46hp/28ft lbs peak...

 

[schl48]

dave, yes on all your questions. bryan theres alot of adjustments that need to be made on a dyno. the temp of the room and all that has to do with the weather have to be set according to todays weather or the room has to be correct to the dyno along with many more settings. i never nor has anyone adjusted any settings before i dynoed was told close enough. it's a tool and as long as i am not going backwards fine.
still got vforce all apart.

 

[OKTRX450R]

bryan theres alot of adjustments that need to be made on a dyno. the temp of the room and all that has to do with the weather have to be set according to todays weather or the room has to be correct to the dyno along with many more settings.[/b]

I have been to 3 dynojet dynos and they all performed this automagically...temp, humidity, gearing, tire size, etc...

 

[Bryan]

. bryan theres alot of adjustments that need to be made on a dyno. the temp of the room and all that has to do with the weather have to be set according to todays weather or the room has to be correct to the dyno along with many more settings. i never nor has anyone adjusted any settings before i dynoed was told close enough. it's a tool and as long as i am not going backwards fine.
still got vforce all apart.
[/b]

I feel ya...Im not concerned with the #'s, I would have liked to keep the extra peak ft lbs but if its between that and popping a head gasket cause its lean then I guess I lose them :fro:


But im almost positive this dyno automatically corrects for all the current weather...it prints out temp, humidity, baro pressure on your sheet along with the date and time.

 

[AL Elks]

Doubt it...The sniffer and a welded in bung are in pretty similar positions. If they differ, its not gonna be noticeable. Optimun reading for A/F are gonna be the first few inches of the header...unfortunately thats not possible with the 'sniffer' and probably not a great idea for the LM-1. Either way...whatever floats your boat.

All I can say is the power commander is bad ass... We plugged it in... set the a/f into the adjustment box for 13:1 and made a few pulls. The computer made every tiny adjustment itself for perfect a/f at 100% throttle...went to 80% throttle, same thing..perfect a/f all the way from bottom to top. 60% throttle...perfect a/f....all the way down to 5% throttle.

The a/f almost looks fake...straight 13:1 all the way across.

My old a/f was hitting 15:1 8-10k rpms....I actually picked up 2.5hp frpm 9k-10k rpms(peak remained the same), but I lost a few ft lbs peak from fattening it up

Its kind of decieving because the bike actually makes power earlier and holds on longer...even though I lost 2.5 ft lbs peak and gained nothing peak hp wise.

46hp/28ft lbs peak...
[/b]

I'll post a pic of where I have the oxygen sensor plugged in. No way I could get a better reading. You really have to be careful when putting something down the tailpipe that you put it in far enough that back pressure doesn't draw in oxygen and you get a false reading. Where I have it that would be impossible.

If you sit down and knock it out it really takes no time to do. I spent more time programming the RPM connection on the LM1 than anything else.

I'm curious about the Power Commander. Tell me what features it has that the FIMAK doesn't. Also can you explain a little more on how you tuned the AFR on the Dyno. I'm not quite sure I understand when you say the computer made the adjustments all by itself. Are you talking about the PowerCommander making the adjustments to the AFR?

How is the PowerCommander monitoring the AFR? Or could it be that I'm off base and the Powercommander plugs into the Dyno somehow and then the dyno does the adjustments.

Here's the pic:

 

[Bryan]

I'll post a pic of where I have the oxygen sensor plugged in. No way I could get a better reading. You really have to be careful when putting something down the tailpipe that you put it in far enough that back pressure doesn't draw in oxygen and you get a false reading. Where I have it that would be impossible.

If you sit down and knock it out it really takes no time to do. I spent more time programming the RPM connection on the LM1 than anything else.

I'm curious about the Power Commander. Tell me what features it has that the FIMAK doesn't. Also can you explain a little more on how you tuned the AFR on the Dyno. I'm not quite sure I understand when you say the computer made the adjustments all by itself. Are you talking about the PowerCommander making the adjustments to the AFR?

How is the PowerCommander monitoring the AFR? Or could it be that I'm off base and the Powercommander plugs into the Dyno somehow and then the dyno does the adjustments.

Here's the pic:

[/b]

Yeah...your 02 sensor is probably a little further down the pipe than a sniffer can go, which is better. Looks like a neat set up actually...

How is the PowerCommander monitoring the AFR? Or could it be that I'm off base and the Powercommander plugs into the Dyno somehow and then the dyno does the adjustments.[/b]

It doesnt. The tuning software uses a 'sniffer' that is stuffed into the pipe as far as possible. The software bases its adjustments off the sniffer and loads the corrected adjustments into the power commander. So once the computer has perfected a map for the power commander based on what readings its getting from the 'sniffer' it then loads them into the power commander.

I'm curious about the Power Commander. Tell me what features it has that the FIMAK doesn't. Also can you explain a little more on how you tuned the AFR on the Dyno. I'm not quite sure I understand when you say the computer made the adjustments all by itself. Are you talking about the PowerCommander making the adjustments to the AFR?[/b]

I think they are pretty close...except you couldnt use the dynojet software for tuning. I have zero experience with the FIMAK so I couldnt help you much in the differences.

Its confusing...Im confusing myself when I think about it but the easiest way to put it is that you input what you want the A/F to be across the board in the dyno's computer. We put 13.0:1 A/F. You then will make a pull...the dyno's computer reads the a/f and will calculate adjustments on how to get the a/f to 13.0:1 by adding or subtracting fuel...it then creates a map and loads in the PC. You make another pull...the dyno reads the differences...and adjusts again to get to your a/f. It then loads the closer map into your PC...The dyno and power commander are connected by a USB port.

3 pulls max and a/f is spot on from idle to redline...I tried to lean out the low-mid range to get a little more power, but there was very little difference...so we left it.

Does that make any kind of sense? :fro:

If so, you will then make pulls for adjustments based on throttle position. We tuned my bike all the way down to 5% throttle with perfect a/f at 5%, 10%, 20%, 40%, 60%, 80% and 100% throttle. Im sure the FIMAK is pretty similar on throttle position?

Even if your a/f is spot on at 100% throttle....it can be WAY off at 80% throttle. Mine definately was.

 

[AL Elks]

Ok!

I've got you now. I think it would work pretty much the same way on the FIMAK if I hooked it to the dyno as it adjusts by fuel percentage also. I think the biggest difference between the PowerCommander and the FIMAK is that you can load an entire map in to the computer/notebook and download it at once with the PowerCommander which can save you time. Unfortunately until someone cracks the code on the FIMAK that is not going to happen. Yoshi screwed us on that part. Once I started using it though it's pretty idiot proof and I can quickly change any points I need.

Doing it the way I have it hooked up take a little longer as I'm guessing as to how much percent to add or take away and then I have to make another run but I eventually get it there. I guess the good thing is that I don't have to take it 3 1/2 hours away to a dyno when I want to tune that sucker.

 

[Bryan]

Ok!

I've got you now. I think it would work pretty much the same way on the FIMAK if I hooked it to the dyno as it adjusts by fuel percentage also. I think the biggest difference between the PowerCommander and the FIMAK is that you can load an entire map in to the computer/notebook and download it at once with the PowerCommander which can save you time. Unfortunately until someone cracks the code on the FIMAK that is not going to happen. Yoshi screwed us on that part. Once I started using it though it's pretty idiot proof and I can quickly change any points I need.

Doing it the way I have it hooked up take a little longer as I'm guessing as to how much percent to add or take away and then I have to make another run but I eventually get it there. I guess the good thing is that I don't have to take it 3 1/2 hours away to a dyno when I want to tune that sucker.
[/b]

Exactly...it just gets done faster with the PC on a Dynojet dyno. I dont think the PC can do anything that a FIMAK cant. A buddy of mine works at Dynojet so I got the PC and tuning for less than a PC retails for so I couldnt shake that :fro:

Only thing is that my curve kinda sucks below 5500 rpms...its not a/f but the curve is pretty wavy and im about 4ft lbs and 4hp short of a Sparks piped, Pro Design Intake and CB LTR until 5000rpms...after that my curve straightens out and pulls away pretty fast from that bike. (It did 40hp and 30ft lbs BTW)

It could be timing...but there is no way to adjust timing yet. But dynojet is working on a Dynatek ignition that will add timing wherever you want it. Mine is a Duner so low end grunt isnt a huge deal but I didnt expect to be that short of a stock motor I guess...

 

[schl48]

brian, thats good to know about the dyno doing the adjusting. all the dynos i've used and had other people used on my equitment must of been without some accesorys.
al, the pc also adjusts at 250 rpm increments while the fimak does 500 rpm. the pc also has a accelerator pump program with it for free. heard good reports but lets remenber its free. also i figure pc will have a little ingnition action before yoshi. also yoshi will probaly come out with a program like pc with the computer and then i woul have to buy that. also jamie at fuelmoto is awesome and help with info and directions which yoshi didn't.

also a friend of mine had some work done on his r450 w/ crower cams and at the dyno he showed 50.2 hp but mine at the track with pipe and pim airbox off was tearing him up.(flattrack.tt) one of the reasons i don't get all crazy about numbers.

 

[AL Elks]

brian, thats good to know about the dyno doing the adjusting. all the dynos i've used and had other people used on my equitment must of been without some accesorys.
al, the pc also adjusts at 250 rpm increments while the fimak does 500 rpm. the pc also has a accelerator pump program with it for free. heard good reports but lets remenber its free. also i figure pc will have a little ingnition action before yoshi. also yoshi will probaly come out with a program like pc with the computer and then i woul have to buy that. also jamie at fuelmoto is awesome and help with info and directions which yoshi didn't.

also a friend of mine had some work done on his r450 w/ crower cams and at the dyno he showed 50.2 hp but mine at the track with pipe and pim airbox off was tearing him up.(flattrack.tt) one of the reasons i don't get all crazy about numbers.
[/b]

You're right about numbers. Numbers will vary from dyno to dyno (from what I've been told). Like FUELATV says you have to get a base line and then do your pulls on the same dyno to see what results you are actually getting. 52 on one dyno might be 47 or lower on another dyno. It actually makes total sense!